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Post by Maolsheachlann on Dec 17, 2018 10:46:26 GMT
What do you think of Samuel Beckett?
I've never seen any merit in his work whatsoever. I would call him a fraud except I think he was entirely sincere.
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Post by cato on Dec 17, 2018 20:22:55 GMT
I think he is a pseud. I have read a few of his plays and they made zero inpact on me. His nihilism is pretty commonplace nowadays . Most post modern people are depressed most of the time. Reading about it is even more depressing.
I suspect the photographic image of Beckett is largely responsible for his overall reputation. Shot in black and white he had a stylish , fashionable dress style and an unmistakable mournful craggy lined face. Living in France and writing in French completes the liberal free thinking sophisticated image. He is an instantly recognisable secular icon .
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Post by cato on Dec 17, 2018 20:24:42 GMT
What do you think of Samuel Beckett? I've never seen any merit in his work whatsoever. I would call him a fraud except I think he was entirely sincere. Many mad people are perfectly sincere too. Not that I think he was mad. Probably just incredibly egotistical. |
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Post by Maolsheachlann on Dec 17, 2018 20:26:37 GMT
He tends to be considered high modern rather than postmodern, but I think you are right. I do think the photographs have a lot to do with it.
When people toss off the names of great Irish writers, he tends to be mentioned, but who actually reads him? Perhaps actors like him because he is an actor's writer, I don't know.
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Post by cato on Dec 17, 2018 20:37:33 GMT
I think I recall seeing some indigestable mush about post modern themes in Beckett in some book I read. Ten wasted minutes of my life I will never get back.
Yes I can't see even serious readers sitting down to read a little Beckett for pleasure. I do have a complete set of his works in a box somewhere. I am not planning to go looking for them.
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Post by Maolsheachlann on Dec 17, 2018 20:40:28 GMT
Apparently the first audiences who saw Waiting for Godot hated it. That was before they were told they had to like it. It's a bit like an EU referendum!
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Post by assisi on Dec 17, 2018 22:08:57 GMT
I think I enjoyed reading 'Waiting for Godot' in my youth. The absurd and surrealistic are much more appealing to young readers as they appear to have novelty and a disregard for tradition and don't put too much of a strain on the intellect. Also they have that frisson of being a little avant garde, which is appealing to some young readers.
I do remember being impressed by Beckett throwing around little philosophical or scientific phrases or terms that I didn't quite understand. I'm sure one such term was 'entropy'. Whether this idea was pivotal to the play or just Beckett showing off, I don't know. My suspicion is that, when you write in a nihilistic postmodern context, it is potentially very easy to put together any old rubbish, sit back, and watch a couple of hundred academics and literary journalists read a plethora of deep ideas into your work and see yourself portrayed as a mysterious guru.
I will probably re-read Waiting for Godot some day and repost here my impressions second time around.
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Post by Tomas on Dec 22, 2018 20:44:46 GMT
I think I enjoyed reading 'Waiting for Godot' in my youth. The absurd and surrealistic are much more appealing to young readers as they appear to have novelty and a disregard for tradition and don't put too much of a strain on the intellect. Also they have that frisson of being a little avant garde, which is appealing to some young readers. I do remember being impressed by Beckett throwing around little philosophical or scientific phrases or terms that I didn't quite understand. I'm sure one such term was 'entropy'. Whether this idea was pivotal to the play or just Beckett showing off, I don't know. My suspicion is that, when you write in a nihilistic postmodern context, it is potentially very easy to put together any old rubbish, sit back, and watch a couple of hundred academics and literary journalists read a plethora of deep ideas into your work and see yourself portrayed as a mysterious guru. I will probably re-read Waiting for Godot some day and repost here my impressions second time around. Recognising these matters from my own youth, his name came up every now and then in the late 80s among some "avantgarde" aquaintances. Especially one friend from school days held Beckett in high esteem but I never really got it myself. Just to see what could be there I tried to read some small work and also once were accompanying this same friend to see a major performance of Waiting for Godot at the national scene Dramaten in Stockholm. However, being there and keen enough to see that very no-story of no-stories, the play made quite an impression then I must say! (This friend became later an independent director in theatre and still works so nowadays in Norway.) |
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Post by kj on Dec 30, 2018 18:13:23 GMT
I'm going to have to leap to the defence of an old idol here!
I think Beckett is one of the most important artists of the 20th century. I also think he is a deeply Christian-centred artist, in that all of his work is fundamentally about God, albeit the experience of God's absence.
Beckett's work is steeped in Christian theology. He was an avid reader of Augustine, Pascal and Dante. His deathbed reading was his old schoolboy copy of 'The Divine Comedy'.
The problem today is that so few critics or cultural commentators have any theological knowledge so he is mis-represented as an 'absurdist', 'postmodernist' 'nihilist' or some such misnomer.
Also, from what we know of his personal life he was an extremely generous man, always helping beggars and down and outs.
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Post by Maolsheachlann on Dec 30, 2018 18:22:28 GMT
I'm going to have to leap to the defence of an old idol here! I think Beckett is one of the most important artists of the 20th century. I also think he is a deeply Christian-centred artist, in that all of his work is fundamentally about God, albeit the experience of God's absence. Beckett's work is steeped in Christian theology. He was an avid reader of Augustine, Pascal and Dante. His deathbed reading was his old schoolboy copy of 'The Divine Comedy'. The problem today is that so few critics or cultural commentators have any theological knowledge so he is mis-represented as an 'absurdist', 'postmodernist' 'nihilist' or some such misnomer. Also, from what we know of his personal life he was an extremely generous man, always helping beggars and down and outs. KJ, you might not believe me, but when I was reading Beckett recently I found myself wondering if you liked him and suspecting you did! I have often heard about his great generosity and kindness. I can believe that. But there is a part of me that wonders what kindness it is to subject audiences to such bleakness! I like the Chesterton quotation: "The only thing worse than the oppression of the people is the depression of the people." However, I may be wrong-- I may be simply missing something. I knew Beckett was extremely scholarly and interested in Dante, etc., but there seems to be no trace of Christian hope in his works. Another problem I have with him is that his work seems incredibly samey. It might be a misnomer to call him an absurdist but all his works that I have read or seen seem to feature characters stuck in a situation where none of their choices make any difference, or who are caught in a kind of paralysis of their own will and intellect. There may be subtle variations I don't pick up on, though. I know artists tend to revisit the same themes, but Beckett's seem very restrictive indeed. |
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Post by kj on Dec 30, 2018 18:27:05 GMT
Well, Maolseachlann, I will be brazen and say that yes, I think you are missing something!
The absence of God and the search for God can be as meaningfully religious experiences as belief in God. Whether one responds to this is a highly personal thing, in my opinion.
For what it's worth, the novels are his main thing. I regard 'Malone Dies' as one of the most beautifully lyric works of prose in existence, and is always where I direct anyone who may not want the too bleak Beckett.
To my mind, Beckett is the last great religious writer of the western canon.
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Post by Maolsheachlann on Dec 30, 2018 18:51:47 GMT
Well, Maolseachlann, I will be brazen and say that yes, I think you are missing something! The absence of God and the search for God can be as meaningfully religious experiences as belief in God. Whether one responds to this is a highly personal thing, in my opinion. For what it's worth, the novels are his main thing. I regard 'Malone Dies' as one of the most beautifully lyric works of prose in existence, and is always where I direct anyone who may not want the too bleak Beckett. To my mind, Beckett is the last great religious writer of the western canon. I agree with your point about the search for God-- indeed, Peter Hitchens argues that Philip Larkin, an avowed atheist, is a great religious poet, especially his poem "The Trees". I get that. I've never read the novels. I might give "Malone Dies" a try. I'm intermittently intrigued by Beckett. |
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