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Post by servantofthechief on Sept 18, 2019 5:06:17 GMT
As most of you doubtlessly know the Pan-Amazon Synod is coming up and there is a great deal of concern over the documents that are being pre-approved for discussion and informing of the event, specifically the Instrumentum Laboris issued by the Secretariat of the Synod of Bishops, which contains serious theological errors and even outright heresy. One prominent feature is clerical celibacy which I believe the document advocates for ts abolition. I won't go into further detail but I will make known that Archbishop Athanasius Schneider and Cardinal Raymond Burke have called for a crusade of prayer and fasting with the intentions of appealing to Our Lord and Our Lady to protect the Synod from all heresy and error and for the grace of our Holy Father to defend and preserve the tradition of priestly celibacy. www.gloriadei.io/petition/crusade-of-prayer-and-fasting/It is simply at least one decade of the rosary a day and one day's fast a week according to your station in life in accordance with the tradition of the Church. Although the crusade started what is now yesterday,on Tuesday the 17th, you may still participate if you wish to offer your prayers and sacrifices for these intentions along with others. Mostly I wished to post this here for those who may be worried, as I am and wish they could help in any way. I advise not to worry as it is all in God's hands and that as St. Padre Pio often said, that you should pray, hope and not worry.
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Post by Stephen on Sept 18, 2019 6:47:49 GMT
I like the sound of crusade!!!
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Post by Maolsheachlann on Sept 18, 2019 9:25:40 GMT
As most of you doubtlessly know the Pan-Amazon Synod is coming up and there is a great deal of concern over the documents that are being pre-approved for discussion and informing of the event, specifically the Instrumentum Laboris issued by the Secretariat of the Synod of Bishops, which contains serious theological errors and even outright heresy. One prominent feature is clerical celibacy which I believe the document advocates for ts abolition. I won't go into further detail but I will make known that Archbishop Athanasius Schneider and Cardinal Raymond Burke have called for a crusade of prayer and fasting with the intentions of appealing to Our Lord and Our Lady to protect the Synod from all heresy and error and for the grace of our Holy Father to defend and preserve the tradition of priestly celibacy. www.gloriadei.io/petition/crusade-of-prayer-and-fasting/It is simply at least one decade of the rosary a day and one day's fast a week according to your station in life in accordance with the tradition of the Church. Although the crusade started what is now yesterday,on Tuesday the 17th, you may still participate if you wish to offer your prayers and sacrifices for these intentions along with others. Mostly I wished to post this here for those who may be worried, as I am and wish they could help in any way. I advise not to worry as it is all in God's hands and that as St. Padre Pio often said, that you should pray, hope and not worry. I'm not in favour of removing clerical celibacy, but at the same time, we should remember that there is nothing heretical about such a suggestion.
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Post by cato on Sept 18, 2019 12:07:58 GMT
Maolsheachlann makes a good point on celibacy not being a dogma of the faith. There are a few books from a conservative angle floating around which go close to claiming it is a doctrine not a discipline. These ignore the troubled history of enforcing the practice at times and the venerable practice of Eastern rites in communion with Rome that permit clerical marriage.
However the Amazonian Synod is a matter of enormous concern. As is now common practice in Rome all sorts of crazy notions are floated out and sly underhand methods are used to promote change. I doubt the massive collapse in South American Catholicism - Mainly to evangelical Protestantism will be stemmed by ordaining married tribal elders with little or no theological education. Ignorant "Massing" priests were a disaster before the reformation and there is no reason to suspect things will be different now.
By all means discuss the issue of celibacy openly. It will not solve the problems we now have with the clergy and episcopate. It will create a new set of problems as we see from the protestant experience! Still I can see some benefits but it is not the magic bullet to solving the vocations decline as some believe.
The synod discussion document itself appears to be a stew of Rosseau's noble savage , new age environmentalism , 1960s sociology and the conspicious absence of catholic tradition and the Gospel. Another typical product of a Vatican were a small clique of nut cases appear to have the papal ear. I couldn't imagine St John Paul allowing this nonsense for a second. How things have declined.
The current response from the vast majority of world bishops is ,in the words of that great theologian Mr Paul Simon - The sound of silence. And the various popes have all called for an honest and respectful dialogue within the church since the 1960s. Something is seriously broken.
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Post by Tomas on Sept 18, 2019 13:17:35 GMT
You can´t hear what you don´t want to hear. You can´t hear what you want to hear either. The sound of silence is dumbing it down till we can´t hear anything more than what the State Directive Complacency Rules 24/7 announces to be some kind of truths.
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Post by Tomas on Sept 18, 2019 14:23:49 GMT
I doubt … etc … will be stemmed by ordaining married tribal elders … Ignorant "Massing" priests were a disaster before the reformation and there is no reason to suspect things will be different now. Word!
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Post by Maolsheachlann on Sept 18, 2019 14:47:58 GMT
I think celibacy is a sign of the uniqueness of the priesthood, and is remarkably prestigious even today. The surrounding culture KNOWS there is something different and special about the priesthood, even when they mock priestly celibacy.
Alas, I rather fear that sheer lack of vocations (in the developed world) means it will eventually be abolished. My hope is that there will still be a significant number of priests who choose celibacy.
I wonder if it will be possible to keep professional priests at all-- whether priests will have to support themselves with another job. Perhaps that's alarmist, but if things keep going as they are, why wouldn't that happen?
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Post by servantofthechief on Sept 18, 2019 17:01:13 GMT
I think celibacy is a sign of the uniqueness of the priesthood, and is remarkably prestigious even today. The surrounding culture KNOWS there is something different and special about the priesthood, even when they mock priestly celibacy. Alas, I rather fear that sheer lack of vocations (in the developed world) means it will eventually be abolished. My hope is that there will still be a significant number of priests who choose celibacy. I wonder if it will be possible to keep professional priests at all-- whether priests will have to support themselves with another job. Perhaps that's alarmist, but if things keep going as they are, why wouldn't that happen? The problem is in practical terms. In better times, maybe the priestly celibacy could be discussed by Church fathers, but in these times, it cannot be done away with. How many liberals do you know advocate abolishing it so that 'allowing priests to marry' would open the door to more married men to become priests. However many married men become priests would be dwarfed by the demand for recognition of married gay priests that will inevitably descend upon the Church, rightfully seeing this as a crack in the armour. The issue of married priests in the Latin Rite cannot be up for discussion in an age where the concept of marriage itself is all but being destroyed. If nothing else the existence of celibate priests in the Western world in such an age is not only a sign there is something unique and special about the Priesthood, but also, conversely, there is something 'seperate' and 'unique' about marriage itself that warrants the separation of the Sacrament from that of the Holy Orders. It may very well be possible that Divine Providence directed and cultivated the tradition of priestly celibacy for JUST such an age, and for JUST such a situation. That is why people are rightfully alarmed and the crusade is targeting that directly as an issue for prayer and fasting. The rest of the document however, is so full of other heresy and theological errors it would warrant the crusade itself, its attempting to paganise and protestantise the Church, to try to 'change' her, yet again. It must be refuted.
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Post by Stephen on Sept 19, 2019 11:21:01 GMT
I think celibacy is a sign of the uniqueness of the priesthood, and is remarkably prestigious even today. The surrounding culture KNOWS there is something different and special about the priesthood, even when they mock priestly celibacy. Alas, I rather fear that sheer lack of vocations (in the developed world) means it will eventually be abolished. My hope is that there will still be a significant number of priests who choose celibacy. I wonder if it will be possible to keep professional priests at all-- whether priests will have to support themselves with another job. Perhaps that's alarmist, but if things keep going as they are, why wouldn't that happen? The Priesthood will continue and is flourishing in traditional quarters. Traditionalism is the future for the church. All one has to do is look were the vocations and converts are going. Instaurare Omnia in Christo!
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