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Post by cato on May 3, 2021 17:44:42 GMT
I have been thinking a bit recently about the old alliance between political and social conservatism and money. I mean big money .Business tycoons entrepreneurs landed types traditionally veered right. There has been a radical political realignment of big business especially in the 21st century. I don't mean there are no wealthy conservatives or rich right wingers. That's just silly but as a class many now , verbally at any rate veer to the radical left. Any thoughts anyone?
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Post by Seán Ó Murchú on May 5, 2021 8:16:59 GMT
I have been thinking a bit recently about the old alliance between political and social conservatism and money. I mean big money .Business tycoons entrepreneurs landed types traditionally veered right. There has been a radical political realignment of big business especially in the 21st century. I don't mean there are no wealthy conservatives or rich right wingers. That's just silly but as a class many now , verbally at any rate veer to the radical left. Any thoughts anyone? The wealthy have been Liberal for generations at this stage! Agreed they are far more woke today but it is a natural process of buying into the poison that is Liberalism |
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Post by Maolsheachlann on May 5, 2021 8:30:44 GMT
I have been thinking a bit recently about the old alliance between political and social conservatism and money. I mean big money .Business tycoons entrepreneurs landed types traditionally veered right. There has been a radical political realignment of big business especially in the 21st century. I don't mean there are no wealthy conservatives or rich right wingers. That's just silly but as a class many now , verbally at any rate veer to the radical left. Any thoughts anyone? Perhaps it has to do with the skills required for a productive workforce. Once upon a time, perhaps until the eighties, it required stability, steadiness, sobriety, etc. There is much more of a premium now on creativity, ingenuity, hustle, continual rebranding. The company man of the thirties, with his briefcase and bowler hat, has become the hipster in a t-shirt and goatee beard. Big business no longer has an interest in encouraging stability and reverence. That's just a guess. |
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Post by assisi on May 6, 2021 14:44:08 GMT
I have been thinking a bit recently about the old alliance between political and social conservatism and money. I mean big money .Business tycoons entrepreneurs landed types traditionally veered right. There has been a radical political realignment of big business especially in the 21st century. I don't mean there are no wealthy conservatives or rich right wingers. That's just silly but as a class many now , verbally at any rate veer to the radical left. Any thoughts anyone? Perhaps it has to do with the skills required for a productive workforce. Once upon a time, perhaps until the eighties, it required stability, steadiness, sobriety, etc. There is much more of a premium now on creativity, ingenuity, hustle, continual rebranding. The company man of the thirties, with his briefcase and bowler hat, has become the hipster in a t-shirt and goatee beard. Big business no longer has an interest in encouraging stability and reverence. That's just a guess. I was quite shocked by the British Chancellor Rishi Sunak's statement in December past, urging people to spend savings accrued during lockdown to get the economy going again. It goes against the wisdom that one should save for a rainy day and try to avoid debt where possible. Here's the quote and some additional info: Mr Sunak said: "I feel good about the bounceback – I think people have been sitting at home, building up some savings hopefully and we would like to go and spend them when we get back." His comments came after a report from the Centre for Business and Economic Research which suggested UK households are estimated to have saved 19 per cent of their disposable incomes in 2020. The figure is almost treble the seven percent savings ratio in 2019 and equates to £7,100 per household, or £197 billion across the country. |
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Post by cato on May 6, 2021 15:06:36 GMT
[quote I was quite shocked by the British Chancellor Rishi Sunak's statement in December past, urging people to spend savings accrued during lockdown to get the economy going again. It goes against the wisdom that one should save for a rainy day and try to avoid debt where possible. Here's the quote and some additional info:
Mr Sunak said: "I feel good about the bounceback – I think people have been sitting at home, building up some savings hopefully and we would like to go and spend them when we get back."
His comments came after a report from the Centre for Business and Economic Research which suggested UK households are estimated to have saved 19 per cent of their disposable incomes in 2020.
The figure is almost treble the seven percent savings ratio in 2019 and equates to £7,100 per household, or £197 billion across the country.[/quote]
I agree with the UK chancellor here. A large percentage of the savings made were made up of not spending on normal services in the last year. Those lucky enough to have made savings can continue to do this if they like but businesses and jobs will be devastated if people do not spend at their normal levels when we emerge from the Covid emergency and keep"saving for a rainy day". It is a rainy day here and now in 2021! If everybody saves everything then the economy collapses.
People who could spend and didn't preferring to save was one of the reasons why the 1929 crash became a decade long economic and social depression which devastated most of the globe.
Cash gains a negative interest rate in most banks at present so most savings are literally losing value over time and are not increasing in value. Finding a place to put money so that it gains in value is one of the great financial topics at the moment.
Naturally we shouldn't spend everything either and individuals need savings for emergencies , pensions etc. Getting a proper balance isn't easy but I think that's what Chancellor Sunak is trying to achieve.
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Post by assisi on May 9, 2021 19:52:29 GMT
Perhaps it has to do with the skills required for a productive workforce. Once upon a time, perhaps until the eighties, it required stability, steadiness, sobriety, etc. There is much more of a premium now on creativity, ingenuity, hustle, continual rebranding. The company man of the thirties, with his briefcase and bowler hat, has become the hipster in a t-shirt and goatee beard. Big business no longer has an interest in encouraging stability and reverence. That's just a guess. I was quite shocked by the British Chancellor Rishi Sunak's statement in December past, urging people to spend savings accrued during lockdown to get the economy going again. It goes against the wisdom that one should save for a rainy day and try to avoid debt where possible. Here's the quote and some additional info: Mr Sunak said: "I feel good about the bounceback – I think people have been sitting at home, building up some savings hopefully and we would like to go and spend them when we get back." His comments came after a report from the Centre for Business and Economic Research which suggested UK households are estimated to have saved 19 per cent of their disposable incomes in 2020. The figure is almost treble the seven percent savings ratio in 2019 and equates to £7,100 per household, or £197 billion across the country. It appears artificial to me that the public should spend just to stimulate the economy. It is better that we live and spend according to our needs as this is acting in accord with reality. If I don't need a new car at this time it is better not to buy one than to buy one for the sake of stimulating the economy. While interest rates for saving are at a minimum there are other wise ways of using the saved money. Why not pay £5,000 off the mortgage? Why not pay £5,000 off from a son or daughter's student loan? It was going beyond our means that led to the 2007/08 crash with people taking out mortgage and other loans beyond their capacity to pay these loans back. Of course some people may lose their jobs, but I think any artificial spending to stimulate an economy will demand more and more such spending just to keep the economy at that level. Eventually this artificiality will lead to a more spectacular crash which may be even more severe on jobs and careers. I would also assume that a significant amount of any saved money spent by the population will not find its way into the national economy but into the hands of the giant multinationals. For example, from March to June 2020, Amazon founder Jeff Bezos saw his wealth rise by an estimated $48 billion. I would prefer that Rishi Sunak said more about spending money on local and regional producers and services and let people decide themselves what they want to do with their money. |
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Post by cato on May 10, 2021 9:47:16 GMT
Assisi no one is suggesting people buy things solely for the sake of buying things to artificially stimulate the economy.
For roughly a year people have put off purchases or haven't been able to spend in shops and services that have been closed and which are now reopening. If people lucky enough to have savings chose not to resume their previous spending habits then those reopened cafes, bookshops , hairdressers , garden centres etc will go bust and jobs are lost. Our individual spending habits do have a wider economic and social impact.
People can of course pay off debt, that's a very sensible thing to do. They should ideally have money put aside for domestic emergencies and provision for sickness and pensions. There are many demands to be made on our money . Too many at times.
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Post by Seán Ó Murchú on May 10, 2021 12:59:53 GMT
Assisi no one is suggesting people buy things solely for the sake of buying things to artificially stimulate the economy. For roughly a year people have put off purchases or haven't been able to spend in shops and services that have been closed and which are now reopening. If people lucky enough to have savings chose not to resume their previous spending habits then those reopened cafes, bookshops , hairdressers , garden centres etc will go bust and jobs are lost. Our individual spending habits do have a wider economic and social impact. People can of course pay off debt, that's a very sensible thing to do. They should ideally have money put aside for domestic emergencies and provision for sickness and pensions. There are many demands to be made on our money . Too many at times. I does seem like you are advocating that people return to the old habits of materialism! I may be picking you up wrong. GAFA or Big tech is a huge concern that people do not seem to be screaming about. I suppose they have bought or convinced the so called left and right. Who is to complain but the "far right & left"! |
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Post by cato on May 10, 2021 13:15:08 GMT
[quote I does seem like you are advocating that people return to the old habits of materialism!
I may be picking you up wrong.
GAFA or Big tech is a huge concern that people do not seem to be screaming about.
I suppose they have bought or convinced the so called left and right.
Who is to complain but the "far right & left"!
[/quote]
I fear you are Sean. Like most things in life there is a golden mean between opposite extremes which is normally the Christian position . Other than those vowed to religious poverty, most of us are called to work and take part in normal commercial life. This is not "materialism". We can and should strive to live simply like our saviour but that's a life long individual struggle.
I know vowed religious who adopt left wing views on the economy and who are vocal social justice fans but have never missed a meal or frequent foreign holidays but they are against "materialism"!
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Post by Seán Ó Murchú on May 11, 2021 10:10:17 GMT
I fear you are Sean. Like most things in life there is a golden mean between opposite extremes which is normally the Christian position . Other than those vowed to religious poverty, most of us are called to work and take part in normal commercial life. This is not "materialism". We can and should strive to live simply like our saviour but that's a life long individual struggle. I know vowed religious who adopt left wing views on the economy and who are vocal social justice fans but have never missed a meal or frequent foreign holidays but they are against "materialism"! [/quote]The problem is they are breaking vows and are a sinner (like us all)! It is much easier to say materialism is a problem than living as non-materialistic as you can. Unfortunately, most Religious today have been infected with Modernism and liberalism which feeds into what you said above(Part and parcel of the post-synodal church). |
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