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Post by cato on Nov 15, 2018 13:43:07 GMT
After the presidential election there was a lot of speculation around Peter Casey and his 23% showing. I don't think this vote was all or mainly conservative as Casey became the main protest anti establishment candidate. Ironically Michael D is at heart of an out of touch establishment.
Casey is vague on most things - a millionaire who claims to be left of centre and who believes the Catholic Church needs a Popessa. I suspect he will go the way of many great right wing hopes and gradually disapear.
Peadar Toibin TD has resigned today from Sinn Fein. Interestingly he says he will tour Ireland testing the waters for an Irish republican pro life party. Toibin is a left winger economically but his brand of politics would be highly attractive to Irish conservatives in the absence of a main stream alternative.
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Post by Maolsheachlann on Nov 15, 2018 14:07:55 GMT
After the presidential election there was a lot of speculation around Peter Casey and his 23% showing. I don't think this vote was all or mainly conservative and Casey became the main protest anti establishment candidate. Ironically Michael D is at heart of an out of touch establishment. Casey is vague on most things - a millionaire who claims to be left of centre and who believes the Catholic Church needs a Popessa. I suspect he will go the way of many great right wing hopes and gradually disapear. Peadar Toibin TD has resigned today from Sinn Fein. Interestingly he says he will tour Ireland testing the waters for an Irish republican pro life party. Toibin is a left winger economically but his brand of politics would be highly attractive to Irish conservatives in the absence of a main stream alternative. Honestly, I don't care about economics that much. I would vote for someone who was economically left-of-centre if they were socially and culturally conservative, and there was nobody better to vote for. Although the combination is rather rare today. (Though not in the past-- apparently Brendan Corish was a devout Catholic who opposed the sale of contraceptives.) I was not at all impressed by Peter Casey in his interview on the Late Late Show. He didn't seem to have any ideas or principles at all. He's no Trump! |
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Post by assisi on Nov 15, 2018 17:10:37 GMT
After the presidential election there was a lot of speculation around Peter Casey and his 23% showing. I don't think this vote was all or mainly conservative and Casey became the main protest anti establishment candidate. Ironically Michael D is at heart of an out of touch establishment. Casey is vague on most things - a millionaire who claims to be left of centre and who believes the Catholic Church needs a Popessa. I suspect he will go the way of many great right wing hopes and gradually disapear. Peadar Toibin TD has resigned today from Sinn Fein. Interestingly he says he will tour Ireland testing the waters for an Irish republican pro life party. Toibin is a left winger economically but his brand of politics would be highly attractive to Irish conservatives in the absence of a main stream alternative. Yes, Casey seems to be difficult to predict, unfocused and trying to please too many people. Which is a pity. As for Toibin, I think he would have a better chance of a pro-life party if he dropped the 'Irish Republican' bit. I think the real prize to be had is to develop a conservative party that attracts support from the Catholic and Protestant community in Ireland, North and South. That would have been unthinkable 20 years ago but could be a viable proposition now. |
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Post by cato on Nov 15, 2018 17:57:26 GMT
]As for Toibin, I think he would have a better chance of a pro-life party if he dropped the 'Irish Republican' bit.
I think the real prize to be had is to develop a conservative party that attracts support from the Catholic and Protestant community in Ireland, North and South. That would have been unthinkable 20 years ago but could be a viable proposition now. [/quote]
Assisi I have a certain sympathy with your view based on my profound detestation for the wicked pointless terrorist campaign of recent years.
However if I was to paint in broad strokes a future right wing party's agenda I would challenge Sinn Fein directly on a United Ireland. It cannot be left to them as their pet project. It will be difficult and expensive but we could end up in a scenario in a few decades were the UK might break up and we may have no choice in the matter. A large unionist bloc in an all Ireland parliament could give social conservatism a large electoral boost.
A conservative party needs to have a vision for the entire nation. In Ireland to date conservative parties have been narrowly economic and socially liberal - the PDs or anti abortion parties that don't even register at election time. Sucessful parties are alliances of various interest groups that come together under a common umbrella.
Arguably De Valera did this in the 1930s . Nearer to our own time Reagan in the 1980s united religious conservatives , anti communists , big business , blue collar democrat supporters and economic liberals in a sucessful big tent movement.
In Ireland many do not share the establishment's vision or enjoy the fruits of recovery. Mobilising the disgruntled and excluded , is key. Deplorables of the nation you have nothing to lose but your chains!
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Post by assisi on Nov 15, 2018 21:35:42 GMT
I agree that any new or 'augmented' conservative party will have to be a broad alliance. I baulk at the 'Republican' in the title because that now carries so much malign baggage for the Unionists that it would be a non-starter for them. I would rather we had some sort of 'Irish and Unionist Party' that would countenance a United Ireland (as already agreed under the Good Friday agreement) but would not pursue it with the aggression and arrogance that Sinn Fein currently do. Such a paty would bide its time until both sides of the border are comfortable with a United Ireland. This includes the possibility that a United Ireland may not happen for generations, if ever. And to differentiate it from the Sinn Fein variety, a new party could look at proposing a federal solution as opposed to a Dublin-centric solution. The above may seem incredibly naive and impossible but more straightforward initiatives don't seem to be working either. New parties like Renua don't seem to capture the imagination. Using existing parties like Fianna Fail may work in the Republic but in the context of an all Ireland basis Northerners from both sides don't really understand or 'get' the two Civil War parties scenario. The candidates up North for a combined party, if one was looking to existing parties, would have been the SDLP and the Ulster Unionists. However both these parties have recently gone socially liberal and globalist. Only the DUP are socially conservative. Sinn Fein are, quite simply, non-Nationalist and non-Christian. The only real potential would be for the old Nationalist/Catholic element of the SDLP (and Sinn Fein) to combine with the DUP to form a new 'Irish and Unionist Party'. Unrealistic perhaps, but the dwindling numbers of Unionists in the North may force parties into alliances that they would never have considered before. Another question is this. Do you develop separate conservative parties or movements in the North and South or do you look to develop one all Ireland conservative party? |
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Post by Maolsheachlann on Nov 16, 2018 10:57:58 GMT
I agree that any new or 'augmented' conservative party will have to be a broad alliance. I baulk at the 'Republican' in the title because that now carries so much malign baggage for the Unionists that it would be a non-starter for them. I would rather we had some sort of 'Irish and Unionist Party' that would countenance a United Ireland (as already agreed under the Good Friday agreement) but would not pursue it with the aggression and arrogance that Sinn Fein currently do. Such a paty would bide its time until both sides of the border are comfortable with a United Ireland. This includes the possibility that a United Ireland may not happen for generations, if ever. And to differentiate it from the Sinn Fein variety, a new party could look at proposing a federal solution as opposed to a Dublin-centric solution. The above may seem incredibly naive and impossible but more straightforward initiatives don't seem to be working either. New parties like Renua don't seem to capture the imagination. Using existing parties like Fianna Fail may work in the Republic but in the context of an all Ireland basis Northerners from both sides don't really understand or 'get' the two Civil War parties scenario. The candidates up North for a combined party, if one was looking to existing parties, would have been the SDLP and the Ulster Unionists. However both these parties have recently gone socially liberal and globalist. Only the DUP are socially conservative. Sinn Fein are, quite simply, non-Nationalist and non-Christian. The only real potential would be for the old Nationalist/Catholic element of the SDLP (and Sinn Fein) to combine with the DUP to form a new 'Irish and Unionist Party'. Unrealistic perhaps, but the dwindling numbers of Unionists in the North may force parties into alliances that they would never have considered before. Another question is this. Do you develop separate conservative parties or movements in the North and South or do you look to develop one all Ireland conservative party? I fear the DUP will also go secular-globalist before long. |
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Post by cato on Nov 16, 2018 12:45:00 GMT
]I fear the DUP will also go secular-globalist before long.[/quote]
It is certainly a possibility. A lot I suspect will depend on its relationship with the Free Presbyterian Church which is no longer as intimate as in the High Paisley period of the 1970s- early 2000s. Ulster protestantism is secularising albeit at a slower pace than Catholicism.
It's galling to think Rome has to all intents and purposes embraced secular global agendas. Bono is now more welcome to the Vatican than Cardinal Burke.
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Post by Stephen on Nov 26, 2018 9:30:27 GMT
Dave Cullen, better known as Computing Forever has a great new Discussion with Justin Barrett of The National Party about Ireland, Northern Ireland and Europe.
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Post by assisi on Nov 27, 2018 22:05:16 GMT
Dave Cullen, better known as Computing Forever has a great new Discussion with Justin Barrett of The National Party about Ireland, Northern Ireland and Europe. Regarding their talk about migrants, there has been a big fuss up in Moville, in Inishowen, where 100 migrants are to be put up at a local hotel, the Caiseal Mara. No-one told the local representatives that this was going to happen. There will be a 7% increase in the Moville population overnight. No-one knows where the migrants/refugees are from, what language they speak, if they have been vetted, whether it is mainly families or singles. I stayed in that hotel about 5 years ago and it is quite small, probably too small for 100 people. There was an arson attack on the hotel before the migrant arrival, luckily no-one was seriously hurt as there were a few individuals in the hotel. Moville is a pleasant small seaside town. It used to be a popular sea-side resort in the 1960s and 1970s but is quiet now and strikes me as a bit run down. I don't know what an extra 100 is going to do to the town. The Dublin government (on this occasion the Justice Dept.) seem to treat people like dirt. The migrants are just pawns in the Government's attempt to dilute Irishness. I do think that they are doing the bidding of the EU globalists. The poor locals are caught between their disgust at the Dublin authorities on the one hand, and on their natural desire to be seen to help others or be called racist. They are all being outflanked by a rotten administration. |
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Post by Stephen on Nov 29, 2018 11:54:14 GMT
Dave Cullen, better known as Computing Forever has a great new Discussion with Justin Barrett of The National Party about Ireland, Northern Ireland and Europe. Regarding their talk about migrants, there has been a big fuss up in Moville, in Inishowen, where 100 migrants are to be put up at a local hotel, the Caiseal Mara. No-one told the local representatives that this was going to happen. There will be a 7% increase in the Moville population overnight. No-one knows where the migrants/refugees are from, what language they speak, if they have been vetted, whether it is mainly families or singles. I stayed in that hotel about 5 years ago and it is quite small, probably too small for 100 people. There was an arson attack on the hotel before the migrant arrival, luckily no-one was seriously hurt as there were a few individuals in the hotel. Moville is a pleasant small seaside town. It used to be a popular sea-side resort in the 1960s and 1970s but is quiet now and strikes me as a bit run down. I don't know what an extra 100 is going to do to the town. The Dublin government (on this occasion the Justice Dept.) seem to treat people like dirt. The migrants are just pawns in the Government's attempt to dilute Irishness. I do think that they are doing the bidding of the EU globalists. The poor locals are caught between their disgust at the Dublin authorities on the one hand, and on their natural desire to be seen to help others or be called racist. They are all being outflanked by a rotten administration. What is happening in the ROI and to a lesser degree in Northern Ireland truly disgusts. It is a modern day plantation and these people are just pawns of the Liberal globalists |
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