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Post by assisi on Nov 10, 2020 20:51:04 GMT
It's very clear the media - not just in the US - is determined to drum the word "baseless" into people's minds. That specific word they have been very keen to ephasise to people. I think it was on Sky News a reporter was talking to someone, then stopped briefly to physically turn to the camera to remind views the accusations were "baseless". It's also interesting, of course, that the media will only talk about observers being blocked (and even that they lie about), but not the more sinister things. Dead people voting, stacks of ballots appearing overnight when counting should have stopped, some stacks being 100% Biden(statistically impossible from a pool of thousands) or at least suspiciously high, apparently these things only happening in States where Biden is lagging behind, voter turn out being suspiciously high in some areas compared to previous elections with one area being over 100%(?!), and a machine that "accidentally" switched some Trump votes to Biden (the people behind the software oddly enough having connections to the Clinton Foundation.) Either this is one of the greatest misunderstandings in history, or greatest frauds. Either way, it's pretty huge, and the media is clearly in on it. But everyone's decided that they hate Trump so much that they don't care, I guess. Even Hibernicus over at the Catholic forums apparently had to think long and hard about the fact that voting Trump would probably be better than voting for the Democrat party, regardless of their nominee. In a sentence, intentional or accidental (and I don't believe in accidents on this scale), there is something abnormal afoot, and nobody has the stones to call a spade a spade because Trump is the bad guy; so I am to believe. I've no doubt that the Democrats cheated. BLM and Antifa were allowed to burn down parts of cities and set up 'autonomous' zones with little or no opposition from Democrats, indeed they got praise. You know that such arrogance, anarchy and disregard for law will find its way into the election counts. Indeed many of the Antifa types are students, teachers, administrators etc. , typical of the type of people who would be involved in voter counts. The danger of cheating is massive. If you were a Republican now, you would feel that however well you do, the Democratic machine can thwart you, so voting again in 4 years time would be futile. And such frustration will explode somewhere. So, while we all wish that the election was over, due process must be seen to be done. |
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Post by Maolsheachlann on Nov 19, 2020 14:45:29 GMT
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Post by cato on Nov 19, 2020 17:34:26 GMT
When I hear some of the complaints against the recent election - A hopelessly biased media , censorship of awkward facts, electoral cheating, social media interference etc I am reminded of the Repeal vote. What made that defeat doubly painful was the unfair sly dishonest methods used.
People who had gone abroad came back in droves . Our electoral register in Ireland is very inaccurate but there is no political will to clear it up.
I do think regardless of those unfair things a majority did decide to vote freely for a liberal abortion regime.
In the USA had it not been for Covid it might have possible for Trump to win. He is though an incredibly polarising figure and the democrats did all in their power to mobilise the anti Trump vote. They got their vote out and they got more out than Trump did. Sooner or later he has to call it quits. He has a strong solid core vote ( almost double that of any Irish party), increased presence in Congress and possibly a Senate veto. And he can plan on a future bid at the White house.
The predicted Blue wave also failed to materialise largely because of the Democrats pandering to social extremists rioters and anti policing groups. Biden will have a difficult time dealing with Covid and may discover he has won a poisoned chalice.
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Post by Tomas on Nov 19, 2020 22:07:39 GMT
If someone "win" by cheat, he does not win. It has not been proved as yet. So the investigations in the legal system has undoubtedly to be diligently processed in each part before any assessment could really come to a close. Is doesn´t matter how unfair a senior lawyer like Rudy Giuliani will be ridiculed from their opponents. Even if the whole establishment stand against the stern facts, it still would have to be judicially proved first. We can pray for seemingly impossible conversion to truthfulness for those involved in the meanwhile. Link is to the press conference today, November 19: www.youtube.com/watch?v=akqeL9AtJYI |
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Post by cato on Nov 19, 2020 22:47:21 GMT
If someone "win" by cheat, he does not win. It has not been proved as yet. So the investigations in the legal system has undoubtedly to be diligently processed in each part before any assessment could really come to a close. Is doesn´t matter how unfair a senior lawyer like Rudy Giuliani will be ridiculed from their opponents. Even if the whole establishment stand against the stern facts, it still would have to be judicially proved first. We can pray for seemingly impossible conversion to truthfulness for those involved in the meanwhile. Link is to the press conference today, November 19: www.youtube.com/watch?v=akqeL9AtJYITomas counts can continue for weeks if need be but the overall result is clear already. A Trump victory at this stage is impossible . |
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Post by Maolsheachlann on Nov 20, 2020 10:17:21 GMT
If someone "win" by cheat, he does not win. It has not been proved as yet. So the investigations in the legal system has undoubtedly to be diligently processed in each part before any assessment could really come to a close. Is doesn´t matter how unfair a senior lawyer like Rudy Giuliani will be ridiculed from their opponents. Even if the whole establishment stand against the stern facts, it still would have to be judicially proved first. We can pray for seemingly impossible conversion to truthfulness for those involved in the meanwhile. Link is to the press conference today, November 19: www.youtube.com/watch?v=akqeL9AtJYITomas counts can continue for weeks if need be but the overall result is clear already. A Trump victory at this stage is impossible . Is there not a danger that we are being gaslit by the media once again, though? Both elections we were told Trump couldn't win. We were told the same thing in the primaries! If someone of Trump's canniness thinks it's worth ploughing on, I can't help wondering if it really is so impossible. |
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Post by cato on Nov 20, 2020 11:59:43 GMT
Tomas counts can continue for weeks if need be but the overall result is clear already. A Trump victory at this stage is impossible . Is there not a danger that we are being gaslit by the media once again, though? Both elections we were told Trump couldn't win. We were told the same thing in the primaries! If someone of Trump's canniness thinks it's worth ploughing on, I can't help wondering if it really is so impossible. If that were to happen and it may be technically possible but I seriously doubt even that then this would be a) The most spectacular political come back in human history and b) the greatest fraud attempt in human history. If it is a vast conspiracy then they aren't going to admit to it at this stage. At times we need to stand back and look at how the electoral college works. I think it was pretty evident from a few days after the vote that Trump had to win all the remaining states up for grabs to win. He failed to achieve that. Case closed. Last time around Hilary won a majority of the votes but not in the right states. That's the system. This time they again won a majority of votes but also in crucial swing states. |
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Post by Tomas on Nov 20, 2020 12:37:25 GMT
Is there not a danger that we are being gaslit by the media once again, though? Both elections we were told Trump couldn't win. We were told the same thing in the primaries! If someone of Trump's canniness thinks it's worth ploughing on, I can't help wondering if it really is so impossible. If that were to happen and it may be technically possible but I seriously doubt even that then this would be a) The most spectacular political come back in human history and b) the greatest fraud attempt in human history. If it is a vast conspiracy then they aren't going to admit to it at this stage. At times we need to stand back and look at how the electoral college works. I think it was pretty evident from a few days after the vote that Trump had to win all the remaining states up for grabs to win. He failed to achieve that. Case closed. Last time around Hilary won a majority of the votes but not in the right states. That's the system. This time they again won a majority of votes but also in crucial swing states. Too early to tell. That was my first point basically. Also technically is the very keyword. Since it is all about complex digital devices, it all hinges on the technical machineries. It´s the proofs on their authenticity, back moves, manipulations of numbers and what not. By shifts actual huge difference can be driven up and down in these kind of systems (as far as anyone can grasp) so even those states that matter are certainly at stake. Cheat by manual labour is linked to the technincal system and thus possible to investigate if the proofs would indicate enough margin for a major turn. We´ll just have to wait a little, and humiliating as it may be even the implicit deficients in accuracy will have to be addressed "before the world". In the end it looks like it will be decided by the system of law rather than the powerful partisan camps or media drives. |
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Post by cato on Nov 20, 2020 17:04:13 GMT
I don't want to cause grief here but this is no way comparable to the Bush versus Gore election decided in the Supreme court.
Trump hasn't a snowball's chance in hell of victory.
His followers are in danger of getting stuck in plain denial of reality. To attempt to deny the result is really copying those Democrats who threw their toys out of the pram in 2016 and claimed Trump was illegitamely elected and was not their president.
There is a bigger point here too. Traditional American and Western institutions are being undermined by intellectuals and media hacks pushing critical race theories and gender ideologies. Democratic institutions are being undermined and discredited. They are far from being perfect but we need to be careful lest we also help undermine core structures that are our sole protection against tyranny .
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Post by Tomas on Nov 20, 2020 19:54:05 GMT
I don't want to cause grief here but this is no way comparable to the Bush versus Gore election decided in the Supreme court. Trump hasn't a snowball's chance in hell of victory. His followers are in danger of getting stuck in plain denial of reality. To attempt to deny the result is really copying those Democrats who threw their toys out of the pram in 2016 and claimed Trump was illegitamely elected and was not their president. There is a bigger point here too. Traditional American and Western institutions are being undermined by intellectuals and media hacks pushing critical race theories and gender ideologies. Democratic institutions are being undermined and discredited. They are far from being perfect but we need to be careful lest we also help undermine core structures that are our sole protection against tyranny . So much pain for fair play? Isn´t it important to least have it examined in all available detail first? I can by sheer hurt see the odds lowering writ on the wall, but why not hesitate till the struggling side find the higher formal door striked closed before doing so here from this far distance. If it after all turns out to be in fact provable it wasn´t in vain to hold on. Nothing to lose by keeping neutral, except few innocent wishes on wasted time in the eventual not-altered outcome. Lack of prestige would be positive for a level of perfectly first class scrutiny, all lights focused on the suspicious shift parts. Only those in the system of law given the relevant material could make the assessments on that obviously. Cheating may also be "acceptable" in some measure since it is inevitable, so if it was as harmless as only a "practical" result of a somewhat flawed campaign in base "use all means"-attitude, not actually changing the very outcome but only distorting by raising the numbers a little, and at the most a widespread uncoordinated kind of semi-fraud to get rid of one man, no moral concerns would be expected for the consequenses either by partisan or other interest. If it will be small proofs here and there and nothing more, after such an unfolding no ground for details remain. Soon enough it has to be let gone for common sense in that case. Prior to that possibly the final silent acceptance among the sceptics may be fixed in limbo. Same as the major sigh among the many others that so quickly has taken that for granted already. We do the little we can to understand a strange infight! |
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Post by hilary on Nov 20, 2020 21:08:43 GMT
I only have a very superficial knowledge of it but I think the vote was close and there was a large postal vote so at least under those circumstances, no harm in hearing the evidence and keeping an open mind surely?! The media bias was so extremely anti-Trump even here in Ireland wouldn't you want to try and do whatever's possible to get the process back to being something that citizens can respect?
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