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Post by cato on Oct 23, 2019 20:15:33 GMT
The passing of a motion supporting the new deal with the EU with a majority of 30 suprised many on Tuesday . At the weekend a majority of 5 or so had been predicted. The second vote to reject the Johnston timetable of a 3 day was more predictable. We seem to be back in the realm of unpredictability.
I was impressed at the stoical attitude of Jacob Rees Mogg who had been verbally abused as he left the commons on Saturday. JRM and his 12 year old son needed a police escort to protect them from furious remainers. Mogg claimed his son was delighted with the police escort. This refusal to play the victim even when justified as here, was a welcome development, one other figures could emulate with profit.
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Brexit
Oct 23, 2019 21:15:18 GMT
Post by Young Ireland on Oct 23, 2019 21:15:18 GMT
The passing of a motion supporting the new deal with the EU with a majority of 30 suprised many on Tuesday . At the weekend a majority of 5 or so had been predicted. The second vote to reject the Johnston timetable of a 3 day was more predictable. We seem to be back in the realm of unpredictability. I was impressed at the stoical attitude of Jacob Rees Mogg who had been verbally abused as he left the commons on Saturday. JRM and his 12 year old son needed a police escort to protect them from furious remainers. Mogg claimed his son was delighted with the police escort. This refusal to play the victim even when justified as here, was a welcome development, one other figures could emulate with profit. In fairness, the Brexiteers have shown themselves to be just as aggressive, as we can see from pro-Remain MPs being threatened. |
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Brexit
Oct 24, 2019 7:48:49 GMT
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Post by Séamus on Oct 24, 2019 7:48:49 GMT
The...etc.... I was impressed at the stoical attitude of Jacob Rees Mogg who had been verbally abused as he left the commons on Saturday. JRM and his 12 year old son needed a police escort to protect them from furious remainers. Mogg claimed his son was delighted with the police escort. This refusal to play the victim even when justified as here, was a welcome development, one other figures could emulate with profit. Mr Jacob wrote a nice article for Express/International Express on the canonization of Cardinal Newman;some months ago the English edition of Messenger also conducted an interview with ReesMogg about his Catholicism and devotion to Anthony of Padua Wonder will this Bulgarian murder(or manslaughter )mystery complicate the Irish boarder issues? |
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Brexit
Oct 24, 2019 8:24:28 GMT
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Post by cato on Oct 24, 2019 8:24:28 GMT
I was impressed at the stoical attitude of Jacob Rees Mogg who had been verbally abused as he left the commons on Saturday. JRM and his 12 year old son needed a police escort to protect them from furious remainers. Mogg claimed his son was delighted with the police escort. This refusal to play the victim even when justified as here, was a welcome development, one other figures could emulate with profit. [/quote]In fairness, the Brexiteers have shown themselves to be just as aggressive, as we can see from pro-Remain MPs being threatened.[/quote]
While not denying remainers have been abused it is significant that the greater level of abuse comes largely from the self professed liberal remainers who regularly remind us are smarter and kinder than everyone else.
I recall a Labour MP on Andrew Marr's breakfast show earlier in the year refer to Tories as Nazis. When asked to withdraw it he said he wasn't strong enough!! The historical ignorance as well as sheer nastiness was breath taking. Pro Brexiteers are regularly protrayed as racist , Nazis and stupid and are expected to put up with it. Should Anna Subry a prominent Tory now remainer be called a Nazi she goes into self pitying melt down. She is one example I select at random.
All abuse and threatening people is wrong and is usually indulged in by people who are unable to debate rationally. Mogg's words and general attitude to the threats on him and his son are a welcome exception to the blame game and something others could copy. A little humour also helps lower the tone of the general hysteria.
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Post by Maolsheachlann on Oct 24, 2019 10:14:25 GMT
Cato, I agree about the dangers of victimhood. Wandering from the subject a bit, that's why I was a little bit bothered by David Thunder's recent article in the Irish Times complaining about anti-Catholic prejudice in Ireland. My late father used to recommend the usage of the word "Catholophobia" to expose this attitude. My response would always be: "The last thing we need is another -phobia". I think it's reasonable to point out the hypocrisy of the double standard, but anything that can be portrayed as self-pity or playing the victim card should be strictly avoided by conservatives, Catholics, and all who find themselves on the wrong side of fashionable opinion. I think the Rees-Moggian stiff upper lip is much better! |
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Post by Maolsheachlann on Oct 24, 2019 10:37:38 GMT
The passing of a motion supporting the new deal with the EU with a majority of 30 suprised many on Tuesday . At the weekend a majority of 5 or so had been predicted. The second vote to reject the Johnston timetable of a 3 day was more predictable. We seem to be back in the realm of unpredictability. I was impressed at the stoical attitude of Jacob Rees Mogg who had been verbally abused as he left the commons on Saturday. JRM and his 12 year old son needed a police escort to protect them from furious remainers. Mogg claimed his son was delighted with the police escort. This refusal to play the victim even when justified as here, was a welcome development, one other figures could emulate with profit. In fairness, the Brexiteers have shown themselves to be just as aggressive, as we can see from pro-Remain MPs being threatened. I agree both sides can be aggressive, but the assumption in the media always seems to be that the danger of violence only comes from Leave supporters. What I find troubling is that Remainers have access to so many more platforms than the Brexiteers, despite the majority of Leavers. I'm talking about this sort of article, where Mark Gatiss seems to be comparing Brexiteers to the inhabitants of Royston Vasey in the League of Gentlemen. And there have been so many similar articles, interviews, songs, comedy routines, etc. Brexiteers are limited to calling Nigel Farage's phone-in show, and stuff like that. It's a very unhealthy situation. I sometimes wonder if the reason anti-Brexit demonstrations more often happen outside Westminster is because people on the other side feel intimidated. Or is it just that the pro-Brexit demonstrations are ignored by the media, like pro-life marches here? I don't know. |
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Brexit
Dec 10, 2020 18:23:29 GMT
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Post by cato on Dec 10, 2020 18:23:29 GMT
A couple of thoughts on the Brexit epic which now enters a finale of sorts.
Recently the UK was offered a 18% fishery refund by the EU to continue to fish in its waters . This was done with a straight face.
Perhaps all parties are playing poker face and there will be a last minute deal (which I hope for) but without the historical decisions by the UK in 1940 to continue the fight against fascism there wouldn't be a democratic Europe . Few if any of the existing EU were on the anti fascist side.This crucial debt of honour bought at enormous expense in blood and treasure has been shamefully forgotten.
Similarly the UK will continue to spend large sums of money to defend Europe post Brexit. France is the only member of the EU to match the UK in defence commitments as president Trump regularly reminds us. Former PM Theresa May took security unilaterally off the table as some sort of good will gesture. For no thanks obviously. EU loving Ireland meanwhile refuses to make any contribution to the defence of the union.
The EU seems to know the price of everything and the value of nothing.
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Post by assisi on Dec 10, 2020 20:45:56 GMT
A couple of thoughts on the Brexit epic which now enters a finale of sorts. Recently the UK was offered a 18% fishery refund by the EU to continue to fish in its waters . This was done with a straight face. Perhaps all parties are playing poker face and there will be a last minute deal (which I hope for) but without the historical decisions by the UK in 1940 to continue the fight against fascism there wouldn't be a democratic Europe . Few if any of the existing EU were on the anti fascist side.This crucial debt of honour bought at enormous expense in blood and treasure has been shamefully forgotten. Similarly the UK will continue to spend large sums of money to defend Europe post Brexit. France is the only member of the EU to match the UK in defence commitments as president Trump regularly reminds us. Former PM Theresa May took security unilaterally off the table as some sort of good will gesture. For no thanks obviously. EU loving Ireland meanwhile refuses to make any contribution to the defence of the union. The EU seems to know the price of everything and the value of nothing. A deal would be better for all. But I hope Boris Johnson doesn't give up on his 'red line' issues. For example the EU want to keep Britain within the same regulatory 'level playing field' governing areas such as workers' rights, environmental protection, taxation and - in particular - state aid (or government subsidies for business). Being tied in to these regulations would severely curtail Britain's ability to reach trade deals with non-EU countries and wouldn't really represent national sovereignty. If Boris comes up with a fudged deal then I think he is finished. He's not popular due to his handling of Covid, so a half hearted Brexit would be his death knell. One of the fears that Remainers had was that trade deals take years to agree. But so far Britain has already agreed 27 deals, covering 57 countries or territories. Essentially, all they did was to retain the existing agreement that the EU already had with these countries and blocs and adapt it for themselves. Britain is also in trade talks with the US, Australia and New Zealand. |
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