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Post by connacht4096 on Sept 14, 2021 2:43:14 GMT
in some respects I opened my presence on this forum with one of the most contriversial of my proposals. would anyone be interisted in hearing more radical ideas on how to make Ireland what it would have been without british invasions?
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Post by Seán Ó Murchú on Sept 14, 2021 7:26:40 GMT
in some respects I opened my presence on this forum with one of the most controversial of my proposals. would anyone be interested in hearing more radical ideas on how to make Ireland what it would have been without British invasions? We will never know and all the plans of men can not turn back time. What you aim to build will be a restoration of an idea or way of living. I am interested in hearing what you have to say. I do think the previous topic is worth exploring more, but maybe in a more PC way. For example, is it moral to banish or expel people that live in a country. This could be the unionists, false religions, recent arrivals, etc.
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Post by connacht4096 on Sept 14, 2021 15:00:15 GMT
one of the ideas is how to gradually phase out the use of the English language as the ordinary daily language of the people; I see value in retaining it as a trade language, but Irish needs to be restored as the primary language of the people; it may take a while to do this, but I am willing to undertake whatever steps are necessary; and I know that if we never start a process, it can never be completed; as a sweetener for the north in this, I am willing to promote ulster scots as well in the process; if it keeps northern protectants quiet while Irish is re imposed on the nation
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Post by Maolsheachlann on Sept 14, 2021 18:16:04 GMT
I don't think any step would be more important in reclaiming our national identity.
It's hard to see how it can be done, though. Most Irish people want to retain the language (which is good) but show no serious enthusiasm for using it.
Ní feidir teanga a athréimú tríd iachaill a chuir ar daoine, measaim. Is feidir iad a muascailt is a mealladh, áfach.
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Post by connacht4096 on Sept 14, 2021 21:42:46 GMT
I don't think any step would be more important in reclaiming our national identity. It's hard to see how it can be done, though. Most Irish people want to retain the language (which is good) but show no serious enthusiasm for using. Ní feidir teanga a athréimú tríd iachaill a chuir ar daoine, measaim. Is feidir iad a muascailt is a mealladh, áfach. I have many different proposals for how we might change that, and they would probably be implemented in stages. it is going to take time of course, the decline of Irish took centuries, so restoring it is going to take several decades at least. stage 1 is to levy a large stamp tax on all documents in English.
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Post by connacht4096 on Oct 26, 2021 17:53:27 GMT
is anyone interisted in further stages?
P. S. sorry I have been a little inactive lately,
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Post by Maolsheachlann on Oct 27, 2021 8:28:27 GMT
is anyone interisted in further stages? P. S. sorry I have been a little inactive lately, Sure, go ahead. Remember line breaks! Everyone has been inactive lately. I've noticed that there seem to be spontaneous lulls in the life of every forum.
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Post by Stephen on Oct 27, 2021 10:55:01 GMT
is anyone interisted in further stages? P. S. sorry I have been a little inactive lately, Sure, go ahead. Remember line breaks! Everyone has been inactive lately. I've noticed that there seem to be spontaneous lulls in the life of every forum. Are you on many forums? I'm also interested
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Post by Maolsheachlann on Oct 27, 2021 12:40:52 GMT
Sure, go ahead. Remember line breaks! Everyone has been inactive lately. I've noticed that there seem to be spontaneous lulls in the life of every forum. Are you on many forums? I'm also interested No, just the Irish Catholics Forum. I used to post on something called The Philip Larkin Society forum which has long been inactive. That was when the internet was new, at least to me. Some thoughts on forums in this post about it. irishpapist.blogspot.com/2019/10/remembering-philip-larkin-society-forum.html
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Post by connacht4096 on Oct 28, 2021 19:12:25 GMT
should i start with proposals on issues besides languages, or should i do more on the Irish language?
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Post by Stephen on Oct 28, 2021 20:26:37 GMT
should i start with proposals on issues besides languages, or should i do more on the Irish language? Whatever you want:)
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Post by connacht4096 on Oct 29, 2021 14:23:45 GMT
another stage of the restoration of the irish language; after levying a hefty stamp tax on all written material in english; would be to abolish the use of english in certain official contexts; so as to gradually phase it out; the point here being to make it so that those who know irish will have situations where they are advantaged by using it; one idea of many is to get rid of trials for small crimes in english; yes people who don't know irish will sometimes have to pay fines for crimes they didn't commit; but its worth it to help encourage the use of our native language
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Post by cato on Oct 29, 2021 14:57:09 GMT
another stage of the restoration of the irish language; after levying a hefty stamp tax on all written material in english; would be to abolish the use of english in certain official contexts; so as to gradually phase it out; the point here being to make it so that those who know irish will have situations where they are advantaged by using it; one idea of many is to get rid of trials for small crimes in english; yes people who don't know irish will sometimes have to pay fines for crimes they didn't commit; but its worth it to help encourage the use of our native language Shouldn't any law be 1) enforceable and 2) Have a substantial amount of support or at least willingness to comply? Passing laws will never resurrect Irish without a popular will. Only a cultural revival will achieve that. Coercion tends to rub the Irish up the wrong way eventually.
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Post by connacht4096 on Oct 29, 2021 16:19:53 GMT
another stage of the restoration of the irish language; after levying a hefty stamp tax on all written material in english; would be to abolish the use of english in certain official contexts; so as to gradually phase it out; the point here being to make it so that those who know irish will have situations where they are advantaged by using it; one idea of many is to get rid of trials for small crimes in english; yes people who don't know irish will sometimes have to pay fines for crimes they didn't commit; but its worth it to help encourage the use of our native language Shouldn't any law be 1) enforceable and 2) Have a substantial amount of support or at least willingness to comply? Passing laws will never resurrect Irish without a popular will. Only a cultural revival will achieve that. Coercion tends to rub the Irish up the wrong way eventually. the unfortunate thing about language is that one person cannot shift it; i cannot suddenly decide that I want to speak a completly different language, and just do it; i loose my ability to be understood if others do not shift; that is why measures like that are usefull; they make more people do the shift at once; I should add that the use of coercian and law is a nessecary evil to me in this case; I would rather not use it, but I don't see any other realistic way to achieve this essential goal of saving and restoring our indigenous language
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Post by cato on Oct 29, 2021 17:23:40 GMT
Shouldn't any law be 1) enforceable and 2) Have a substantial amount of support or at least willingness to comply? Passing laws will never resurrect Irish without a popular will. Only a cultural revival will achieve that. Coercion tends to rub the Irish up the wrong way eventually. the unfortunate thing about language is that one person cannot shift it; i cannot suddenly decide that I want to speak a completly different language, and just do it; i loose my ability to be understood if others do not shift; that is why measures like that are usefull; they make more people do the shift at once; I should add that the use of coercian and law is a nessecary evil to me in this case; I would rather not use it, but I don't see any other realistic way to achieve this essential goal of saving and restoring our indigenous language Perhaps the approach of people like Douglas Hyde and the Gaelic league is preferable than the later policy of linguistic compulsion? I know the league wanted compulsion too but I think the state can often end up undermining a cultural movement as it did in Modern Ireland by a stale unimaginative approach, overly concerned with literature and not Irish as a spoken medium.
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